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Post Info TOPIC: Sage - perpetual licences on disc


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Sage - perpetual licences on disc


Well well, I had a call from Sage yesterday whilst I was visiting a client about said client.   Now telling me (after saying client was moving from sage if they carried on with their ridiculous hard sell for MTD and £1800pa charges with no disc!) that they were listening to customers who were complaining about not having renewals on disc and that they were aware of mass migration of clients given there stance of only offering sage on monthly licence.

But not only that they could provide the next two upgrades, which includes fully functioning MTD compatible (and GDPR) for £475 + VAT.

Now bear in mind this client has a two company licence and 3  users (might be 4 cannot recall) of Sage 50 PRO   (the top version with fully functioning stock facility) and this seems much more reasonable.

Not only that - when you compare it to the like of sage quoting £30pm + VAT for MTD link alone then its a bit nearer the ball park of a reasonable price.  (albeit I fully accept you can get MTD link for less than that.  But what sage do in software terms, they do very well).

Also bear in mind that this gives them v25 (next years) licence as well as v24 on a perpetual disc.  

This client got about 10 years out of the last one and the only thing thawting him with the current version is MTD.  BUT he might not update just due to MTD.  One other consideration is the fact that the new sage does has quicker ways of multi paying sales invoices, which for him would be much better and save on my bookkeeping fees.

 

Only catch - the offer is only on for 2 days (one of which was yesterday).   Ha, Ive already pushed that one back until a decision is made properly so I have at least another week (strange how moveable such things can be).

So folks, if your clients wish to do something - today might be the day.  

Anyone having problems getting said offer and/or an extension on a decision then PM me and I will let you have my contact!



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Hi Joanne,

Very interesting. I've had several customer accountants/bookkeepers ask me about whether our software will work with the subscription versions (it will) but in the context of it being a factor in their clients seriously considering a move away from Sage. They've all been getting the Sage "hard sell". Do Sage not realise they are shooting themselves in the foot with their strong-arm tactics? There's a discussion ongoing on sageforum.co.uk called "Sage & MTD Scaremongering " on the same subject.

It sounds like Sage are conceding, at least for a limited time, the same arrangement that SJ Software (no connection, just a happy customer) have had available for some time. Unlike Sage, it is not a time limited offer. If they withdraw the offer, buy from SJ Software - they're probably cheaper anyway. biggrin

Regards,



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Ian

Ian Brown FCA
Onion Reporting Software Ltd

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Sage accounts in Excel. No set-up necessary. Free trial.



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Hi Joanne...

"Well well, I had a call from Sage yesterday whilst I was visiting a client about said client.   Now telling me (after saying client was moving from sage if they carried on with their ridiculous hard sell for MTD and £1800pa charges with no disc!) that they were listening to customers who were complaining about not having renewals on disc and that they were aware of mass migration of clients given there stance of only offering sage on monthly licence."

Hmm... what this says to me is: Sage has (for as long as I can remember) been high priced, and in the last few years their approach has been one of "We have a captive market, so now we can be even greedier..." - but that has bitten them on the arse. Their market isn't captive as they thought, and they're starting to take some action to avoid losing it altogether.

...and Ian.

"It sounds like Sage are conceding, at least for a limited time, the same arrangement that SJ Software (no connection, just a happy customer) have had available for some time. Unlike Sage, it is not a time limited offer. If they withdraw the offer, buy from SJ Software - they're probably cheaper anyway."

Agreed - looking back though some old records, I realised it was SJ Software that I'd bought from previously, before (for whatever reason I've forgotten) taking out SageCover Extra from Sage themselves for a couple of years - and then having my argument with Sage about spamming. And I've never upgraded since.My current position is unchanged: I'm doing nothing (and spending no money) until closer to the deadline, when the wider choices will be more apparent.



-- Edited by VinceH on Friday 17th of August 2018 09:49:52 AM

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Vince M Hudd - Soft Rock Software

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Hi boys
Agree with you guys that SJ Software have been consistently good with offers and not at all pushy. They were recommended to me a few years back, although I ended up with mine via a training company in the end, on a good deal. But direct from Sage for a client (again that WAS a good deal!)

I dont like the 'this offer is a 2 day thing' from ANY company and ignore such generally (bit double glazing salesman-like), but its generally not a bad price for their top bit of kit so thought it should be put out there, along with the acknowledgment that they seen some kind of mass migration away from them.

Ive come across that forum before Ian, but in truth never got round to looking at it so will have a gander at that posting this afternoon.



-- Edited by Cheshire on Saturday 18th of August 2018 12:54:23 PM

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Joanne  

 

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Oh and now Im on hold with someone else from Sage about another user. They phoned me and are flat out denying they do disks and that there is an offer on, but now running rounded all bobble headed trying to find out about it! Funny as....well it would be if I wasnt trying to get some work done! But I will play cat and mouse a few minutes longer.

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Joanne  

 

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Oh and now they have just told me that Im on automatic renewal and they sent me an invoice a month ago... funny that. Never seen anything that states im on auto renewal when its a perpetual licence offer!!!!  Plus where in hell is the update then?

Then tried to say they couldnt send said invoice again in the post......... it had to be emailed - well they arent having my email address I told them. So then she tried telling me to view it via 'My Sage'. Doesnt she think I banged my head when I fell out of the last tree. 'Ah but dont you need an email address when you log into that?' says I. Yes of course you do.

They have also tried to tell me that the rate for my renewal is three times the one my client is getting - and we have the exact same number of users/licences/companies. So 'do you have a customer tier system' as well as a product one I asked. That was denied.

I think I will reserve all conversations for the managerial member of staff I am speaking to on Friday!



-- Edited by Cheshire on Monday 20th of August 2018 04:39:56 PM

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Joanne  

 

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"well they arent having my email address I told them."

Given that it was their misuse of my email address that sparked my disagreement with them, I don't blame you!

"So then she tried telling me to view it via 'My Sage'. Doesnt she think I banged my head when I fell out of the last tree. 'Ah but dont you need an email address when you log into that?' says I. Yes of course you do."

Unless I'm misremembering, or things have changed, I'm sure I was still able to log in to 'My Sage' even after they wiped my address from their records.

Ah, no - just checked. In October 2012 (yes, it was six years ago now!) I wrote that having logged into my account, the email subscriptions tab now shows an error and I concluded that "this is the result of my previous complaint to Sage that wiping or eradicating my email from their system was achieved by disabling this aspect of my account altogether (or this aspect of my account is disabled because my email address is no longer in my account other than as part of the log-in)."

So, yeah, the email address is used for the log-in. Which means I could have saved myself the effort of this reply, because what I was going to say and started out saying was in fact wrong.

Oh, just ignore me, it's been a long day. :)



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Vince M Hudd - Soft Rock Software

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VinceH wrote:

Oh, just ignore me, it's been a long day. :)


 biggrin   I know the feeling!

 



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Joanne  

 

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Hi Folks,

Update: here's what I've heard recently.

Making Tax Digital Module (MTD) for Sage 50 Accounts Perpetual Licences - software must be V24 or greater to enable this module. Annual Licence (RRP £300 + VAT).

However, Prices from SJ Software -

Purchase now and this special offer is available. The renewal of the MTD Module would be 31.12.19.

MTD Module for Sage 50 Accounts Essentials - £110 + VAT per annum
MTD Module for Sage 50 Accounts/Plus/Professional - £215 + VAT per annum

I believe there may also be an offer on Sage 50 Accounts Essentials Perpetual Licence + the MTD module (to 31.12.19) for £199 + VAT  ? offer available until 31.12.18.

It seems that, whilst you can buy a Perpetual Licence, you'll be locked into an annual subscription to keep the MTD module running. Still, much cheaper than, for example, £240 + VAT per annum for Sage 50 Accounts Essentials on subscription from Sage.

Regards,

(Disclaimer: I have no connection to SJ Software - just a long time happy customer.)



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Ian

Ian Brown FCA
Onion Reporting Software Ltd

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Sage accounts in Excel. No set-up necessary. Free trial.



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What an absolute fucking rip off.

As far as I know (and I've been trawling around looking to double check*), there is no charge by HMRC to software vendors to use the API for MTD submissions. No charge whatsoever.

So how the hell can Sage justify a £300 annual licence for a piece of software that uses it? (And I bet that price won't be flat - it'll go up if you have multiple companies).

The ONLY way any subsequent payments after the first is acceptable is if the API changes, so the software has to be updated - but that should bloody well mean the option of buying an upgrade.

* Some useful links:

HMRC's API strategy - no mention of fees: www.gov.uk/government/publications/hmrc-third-party-tax-software-and-api-strategy/hmrc-third-party-tax-software-and-application-programming-interface-api-strategy

PDF file: "Making Tax Digital for Business - VAT Guide for Vendors" - no mention of a fee. www.tax.service.gov.uk/api-documentation/assets/content/documentation/446270b81ad1b6e7e27d4592afdba771-mtdfb-vat-guide-for-vendors.pdf

That PDF is linked here, along with one for SA: developer.service.hmrc.gov.uk/api-documentation/docs/mtd - that's part of the HMRC Developer Hub: developer.service.hmrc.gov.uk/api-documentation - all of the many APIs are openly detailed there, somewhere.






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Vince M Hudd - Soft Rock Software

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Having sat back with a coffee, and given this some more thought (bearing in mind I am cynical to a fault):

This could be a crafty move by Sage: Customer buys one of the accounts packages on a perpetual licence, then has to start paying their new MTD tax. Each year, even if there are no actual changes to the API, they 'update' the MTD module. After 'n' years, the latest version of the module is no longer compatible with the customer's version of the main accounts software - so the customer is forced to update. :(



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Vince M Hudd - Soft Rock Software

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I'm reminded of the film "Mr Deeds".

"I may have underestimated their sneakyness!"  biggrin



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Ian

Ian Brown FCA
Onion Reporting Software Ltd

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Sage accounts in Excel. No set-up necessary. Free trial.



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Like I said, you do need to bear in mind how cynical I am - but I've been using Sage software since the very late 1980s (I think they started at the other end of the same decade), and my cynicism towards them has very much been earned BY them.

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Vince M Hudd - Soft Rock Software

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Hi boys
Dont think Ive seen Vince so mad! Actually Ive been meaning to update this post, but just was fuming myself and not had much time and then kept forgetting. I almost suggested to Shaun that he delete it.

The offer was as non offer from what I can gather.

Everytime I asked about whether v24/5 would be fully compatible with MTD I was told its compatible as MTD stands now. So how about that for a fudge. It only became clear after trying to get them to put that in black and white in an email that there was some shall we say, bending of the truth going on.

After a good while on the phone and several attempts to pin things down there was a mention of this module, which then appeared to be confused with - was it for any future updates, would it still work if they carried on with v25 etc etc.

I ended up phoning SJ Software whose first words were those versions are not compatible from what they have been told. I then phoned my supplier - connected to a training company, who said they were not aware that v25 was compatible but would phone sage. The message I got back was that it would need the additional module. At a cost. So clearly what I was being told was complete bull do dah.

What really made me mad was when I got home from said clients was goingh back to my invoice debarcle. Caller stated that I was in contract, a rolling contract and that I had to now pay the invoice for the full years sage cover (£1500 or £1800 from memory) as I hadnt given a months notice prior to the last cover expiring. I had cover (free) on the back of a dirt cheap double upgrade I did a year back. Dirt cheap obviously cos they know its not MTD compliant. Hence Im sure why this offer (from the start of the thread) was so cheap!

I asked for a copy of the terms and conditions that I had signed. Not that I had. Bear in mind I also bought this from a third party so how they could try to enforce that one is anyone's guess. Plus it was a perpetual licence anyway. They did actually send me some conditions. No idea what service they for for. Had 'sage' on it but no other specifics as to product so could easily have come from a proper rolling contract for some of their product or other. Daft thing was the date was May 2018. When I bought the sage it was July 2017!

I rang their credit control department and actually got a non sales normal, kind of more honest chap, who said he would just cancel the invoice. No questions asked - up to me. Job done. Funnily enough though their so called May 2018 contract did state in one of the clauses that non payment of said invoices cancelled the contract between both parties anyway.

Blatent lying seems to be the order of the day. Worryingly!

Of course sage have had a battering the press and by shareholders by all accounts for not reaching their targets for signing up folk onto the subscription model, so they are out to sign up whatever they can. I feel a move to other software for more of my client base is inevitable.

Or if you have to buy anything from them, do so via reputable external agents such as SJ.


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Joanne  

 

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"Dont think Ive seen Vince so mad!"

:)

I lose my temper all the time - but generally, all the online forums etc are neatly boxed up so that certain ones never see me blow my top. This was at best a timing glitch; I read Ian's post at exactly the wrong time, having had a bit of a PITA day.

I also made an angry post on Twitter, @ mentioning Sage. Can't be bothered to log-in and link, so I'm just copying the text from the Twitter client on my phone. I said:

Are HMRC charging software companies for their software to be able to access the APIs for things like MTD?

AFAIK, no.

So how the fuck can rip off merchants like @sageuk justify an annual fee for the MTD module?

Fuckers.

(People who follow my twattisms on twitter will know that's not out of character for me in the slightest*)

I had a reply from their @askSageUKI account today:

Our latest software includes MTD module, as we're committed to ongoing development of this. We develop solutions which add great value to customers rather than update old versions. On subscription you can access latest updates. Older versions can purchase MTD module.

That completely fails to answer the point I made, and in some respects comes across as an attempt to justify the subscription model. However, note it says "Older versions can purchase MTD module" - I wonder if he means on a perpetual licence, or he's just pulled the wrong word into his comment in his attempt to placate me with a non-answer.

So I've replied (a little more politely this time):

So what I was told yesterday (from a third party, not Sage) [i.e. I'm referring to Ian's post here, but not linking to it] was wrong? If I buy the latest version of Sage on a perpetual licence, it will include MTD - and the MTD module will keep working without me having to pay again and again?

It'll be interesting to see the answer.

"I feel a move to other software for more of my client base is inevitable."

Indeed. The problem is finding something that can actually work for the clients I have in Sage - whenever I've tried looking at alternatives, nothing has ever cut the mustard.

 



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Vince M Hudd - Soft Rock Software

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Morning guys 

Is it not possible to continue using your perpetual version and do a CSV dump to bridging software?  That'll give you an extra year and then we can see what form MTD digital will take, if they still plan to go ahead in 2020.

Personally, I would dump sage at the first opportunity, or at least have something different ready for when Sage could no longer be used without a subscription.  Problem is there isn't much desktop software about, is there?

Is hybrid software possible?  eg You do all the work locally on the computer and it's then transferred to the cloud if required, making it accessible from anywhere.  I have in the back of my mind something akin to one drive, where it's stored locally as well as in the cloud, but I appreciate that is just file storage, not software.  I do think there would be a market for it.



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Hi John,

"Is it not possible to continue using your perpetual version and do a CSV dump to bridging software?"

As we've previously discussed, that's what I'm really/hoping to be able to do when the time comes. It would be so much simpler if I could just submit from within Sage, though - so if there is any hope of an option to do just that (without being ripped off with an annual fee) I'll investigate it.

Someone I know has just taken over development/sales of an old accounts package for RISC OS (called Prophet, originally by a company called Apricote Studios, now Accountz having switched to Windows development a very long time ago). He's currently looking into the whole online VAT submissions issue - last I spoke to him, he'd registered a developer account with HMRC and was close to being able submitting his first test return in their sandbox. The software is multi-company out of the box and I'm therefore looking at that as a possible bridging solution; export from Sage, import into that, submit.

However, whether it's actually possible to do that remains to be seen. This is a bit of an unknown until HMRC settle on what has to be submitted, and what their service can interrogate the submitting software for (a long time since I read it, but I'm sure that was one aspect of MTD - the API requesting information from the software as part of the submission process), it's not possible to know whether the exported data from my existing Sage will be adequate. This is probably one of the reasons HMRC describe the API as a "breaking" one at the moment - it's still largely in the testing phase, and may change, so existing solutions may break.

As to switching to Prophet, rather than using it as a bridging solution, at this point I don't know how practical that is. The last time I tried it (over twenty years ago) it wasn't suitable for my needs then, so given the timing of all the changes and the new version, I doubt it has changed enough to cope with my needs now - but until I see it/try it for myself, I won't really know. I'll hopefully have the chance to do so towards the end of next month.

(I will be buying a copy at that point anyway - because even based on the twenty year old version, it will do nicely for my own accounts these days.)

"Personally, I would dump sage at the first opportunity, or at least have something different ready for when Sage could no longer be used without a subscription.  Problem is there isn't much desktop software about, is there?"

The problem is twofold - the increasing lack of desktop options, coupled with no other desktop packages (when I've looked previously) coming even close to being able to replace Sage for my needs. Otherwise this discussion would  "Is Sage an option to replace what I'm using now?" rather than what it is!

"Is hybrid software possible?  eg You do all the work locally on the computer and it's then transferred to the cloud if required, making it accessible from anywhere."

The problem with accounts software is that there is no standard internal format (CSV is not suitable for general storage of the data) - so "available from anywhere" would be "available from anywhere that you can run the same software". Every different vendor uses their own internal format for the data to suit their own requirements, to support the different features and abilities of the software.

As to my Twitter conversation, I had a reply this morning. Remember that my second tweet consisted of two quite simple questions:

So what I was told yesterday (from a third party, not Sage) was wrong? If I buy the latest version of Sage on a perpetual licence, it will include MTD - and the MTD module will keep working without me having to pay again and again?

The response was:

I recommend that you contact us on 0800 33 66 33 or at SBDSalesSupport@sage.com and we'll be able to explain your options to you in detail.

I replied:

If you can't give a simple "yes" in answer to those simple questions, then it's clearly "no" - what I was told is NOT wrong, and there is no option to buy something to make MTD submissions on a perpetual licence.

I've just noticed a reply to that:

If it's a perpetual licence you'd prefer, you'd need to purchase the MTD module on subscription as an add-on. If you were on the latest software on a subscription basis, the MTD module would be included in your software as part of your subscription.

My reply:

In which case my original point stands - a subscription model for the MTD module is a complete rip off. HMRC aren't charging software developers to access/use the API, but you are charging users for the same. A subscription model is a con.

 Edit: Formatting went off on its holidays.



-- Edited by VinceH on Friday 7th of September 2018 10:49:18 AM

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Vince M Hudd - Soft Rock Software

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And I've just realised my own VAT is due today - and I haven't done a shred of work on it in the entire quarter (and was in pretty much the same situation last time, so took a short cut and submitted an incomplete one; all of my sales, almost no expenditure) - so I have the better part of six months worth of work to do! =:o

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Leger wrote:

Morning guys 

Is it not possible to continue using your perpetual version and do a CSV dump to bridging software?  Yes its possible and one I told sage I would be doing.  The problem as I see it is the constant shall we say 'half truths', which is probably being generous and rip off charges (yes I know they are a business trying to make money, but are doing so with spurious commets!) That'll give you an extra year and then we can see what form MTD digital will take, if they still plan to go ahead in 2020.

Personally, I would dump sage at the first opportunity, or at least have something different ready for when Sage could no longer be used without a subscription.  Problem is there isn't much desktop software about, is there?   Issue is - sage is a bloody fab bit of kit especially if you need it for stock and multi currency stuff as I do.  I reckon it might last until I retire (which might be sooner than I was originally planning!)

Is hybrid software possible?  eg You do all the work locally on the computer and it's then transferred to the cloud if required, making it accessible from anywhere.  I have in the back of my mind something akin to one drive, where it's stored locally as well as in the cloud, but I appreciate that is just file storage, not software.  I do think there would be a market for it.


 



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Joanne  

 

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Ah, yes... this reminds me: the final tweets in that conversation with Sage:

In reply to my last one above, where I re-iterated that a subscription model is a con (because Sage aren't being charged for access to the API), Sage said:

A subscription model enables our customers to benefit from the latest updates and features as part of their ongoing contract Vince, however, I've passed your feedback onto the relevant department for consideration.

To which I said:

But when the MTD API is fully settled (i.e. I know RIGHT NOW it's still in flux) and the software is fully working with it, it's not necessary to subscribe to 'benefit' from updates. If a new, updated version is worth buying, it'll be bought.

The simple truth here is that Sage have done themselves out of a sale - perhaps two sales going by Joanne's comment, and quite probably more - because if a MTD-capable version was available on a perpetual licence, I would have upgraded if and when I needed to. Should a suitable bridging solution appear, that need simply isn't there.

(True, that would be the case regardless of whether or not MTD-capability was available on a perpetual licence, but I would have made an exception to my rule in this case for the sake of simplicity. I won't on a subscription basis, though.)



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Vince M Hudd - Soft Rock Software

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VinceH wrote:

Ah, yes... this reminds me: the final tweets in that conversation with Sage:

In reply to my last one above, where I re-iterated that a subscription model is a con (because Sage aren't being charged for access to the API), Sage said:

A subscription model enables our customers to benefit from the latest updates and features as part of their ongoing contract Vince, however, I've passed your feedback onto the relevant department for consideration.

To which I said:

But when the MTD API is fully settled (i.e. I know RIGHT NOW it's still in flux) and the software is fully working with it, it's not necessary to subscribe to 'benefit' from updates. If a new, updated version is worth buying, it'll be bought.

The simple truth here is that Sage have done themselves out of a sale - perhaps two sales going by Joanne's comment, and quite probably more - because if a MTD-capable version was available on a perpetual licence, I would have upgraded if and when I needed to. Should a suitable bridging solution appear, that need simply isn't there.

(True, that would be the case regardless of whether or not MTD-capability was available on a perpetual licence, but I would have made an exception to my rule in this case for the sake of simplicity. I won't on a subscription basis, though.)


 Four from me Vince as I had a few clients interested as well!

''Passed your feedback on....for consideration'' - my response would be  'I wont hold my breath, myself and several pals have been telling Sage for a few years now that they dont want a subscription model'.  



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Joanne  

 

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Good point - I have almost no experience of Sage acting on feedback except in one case: When there was a serious bug in the bank rec screen of the software, and they did actually fix it. However, getting them to acknowledge or accept my bug report was an absolute nightmare - they wouldn't talk to me because I didn't have Sage Cover. I got very heated in all conversations with them until they finally took notice.

My argument was that Sage Cover should be for people who need support using the software (how do I do this, what have I done wrong here, etc) but it should be possible to report actual functionality problems - bugs in the software, etc - without such a contract. (Also, given the price of the software, it shouldn't be 30 days free support - it should be a full year; only then charge (or sell a new version to repeat).

That bug - Sage users here may or may not have experienced it, depending on timing. I forget which version it was, but it was possible to select a number of transactions in the reconciliation screen, click reconcile, and the transactions that were transferred to the lower, reconciled pane wouldn't necessarily be the same ones.

The cause was the way the software worked out which transactions were selected when the button was clicked - which was it calculated where the highlighted lines were in the upper pane. The problem was when you resized the panes, it was possible to partially obscure the bottom-most visible line in the upper (unreconciled) pane. Whether the correct transactions were transferred to the reconciled pane depended on *how much* of that line was obscured - a rounding error in the calculations; so the selected transactions could be offset by one.

It was difficult to report the problem, and when I finally got them to listen I had to have the guy I spoke to connect to my computer using VNC or RDP (whichever they use) so I could demonstrate not only the problem, but show him what the cause was.

In fact, thinking back, I may have had similar issues reporting a problem before, because I remember banging my head against a brick wall over issues with emailing statements etc directly from Sage. (To this day, I still have it set up to CC copies of everything back to myself as a direct result of that problem - which was that it would get so far and then give up, saying "The directory is not empty". This was a timing thing; the email was created in a temporary folder ready to be sent, then the function called that would send it. In theory, when the email was sent the directory could be deleted - that error indicated it was trying to delete the directory after a while, and failing because the email hadn't yet gone; slow connection. It should have been *checking* the directory was empty first, and if not waiting a little while longer, until a sensible time out, then reporting a send problem.)

The other side of reporting problems is making practical suggestions - and I made quite a few over the years I was on speaking terms with the company. To the best of my knowledge (certainly up to the point of the last newer version I've used, a couple of versions back now at least) none of them have been implemented.

One example? On the screen for inputting batch supplier (or customer) invoices (or credits). Resize it so its as narrow as it will allow. Look at the panel at the top. See that wasted space in the middle? I suggested populating that with user-selectable fields, because different people have different needs. For example, I could use a field for one of my clients to hold a reference code from a third party agency, and perhaps also display the postcode there.

In the end, I sort of solved the problem a different way - on the supplier accounts for the client that would have been useful for, I now include that third party reference in brackets after the trading name, followed by their postcode in square brackets. Unfortunately, that's still flawed because the supplier name field as displayed isn't always big enough, so another option would have been for them to just make that bigger. Either way, use some of that wasted space.

Feedback at Sage, I'm sure, gets filed in the circular letter holder.

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Vince M Hudd - Soft Rock Software

(I only came here looking for fellow apiarists...)



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Hi Vince
I recall you saying about your problems feeding back that issue to sage before. They are a typical call centre lot in that anything that doesnt fit their script gets the 'computer says no' response. Unless you can get past the drones to someone who speaks like a normal human being in which case you may be in with half a chance. I only say 'may be'!!

No they havent adopted your suggestions. They are clearly either making up their own or do introduce some options but personally they have mostly been what I would consider minor tweaks over the years, although some look like big tweaks but its just because they have moved things!

Couple of the things they have done is to add a payments field on the batch invoice screen so you can pay (with a date) at the same time as enter the invoices. Plus you get greater visability when looking at the transactions section without even having to go through the corrections option to do a search (as was the case in at least the earlier versions/v12 ish sage).

One thing I do wish they would show on reports (without having to mess with them) is the 'ex ref' field as I use that a lot along with the reference field especially for one of my clients who eg inputs say a suppliers invoice number, details of what has been bought along with car registrations. Or maybe this is an easy way to extract the info and I dont know about it - cos Im not very techy Im a bit pants on the report designer bit. Mind you I find the export to excel and pivot does what I need if and when I really need it.



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Joanne  

 

Winner - Bookkeeper of the Year 2015, 2016 and 2017

Thoughts are my own/not to be regarded as official advice,which should be sought from a suitably qualified Accountant.

 



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Another one is the bank transfers dialogue box - the layout (and/or tab order) is silly. Being on the wrong machine now I can't check which it is (if not both) but there is an oddity there.

And a related bug is that with that dialogue open, tabbing between fields doesn't work in certain other screens.

Up to the point of my version, these problems had been present for a loooong time - and they HAVE been pointed out.

Edit: Thinking back, at one point - because they didn't seem to act on these things (and because they claimed to have a feedback / suggestion page - but suggestions made were never disclosed) - I started a document on my computer noting down when and what suggestions I made, to see how long it would take them to be implemented. By the time of my spat with them, not a single one had been.

It would be an interesting document to look at now, but I don't think I've brought it forward from whatever computer I was using at that point because of my decision to avoid upgrading to new versions: I never would see if they'd done anything.



-- Edited by VinceH on Thursday 13th of September 2018 06:51:44 PM

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Vince M Hudd - Soft Rock Software

(I only came here looking for fellow apiarists...)

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